Questioner: David
Subject: same sex marrigeQuestion:
Hello John, Although it's true we are all sinners by nature, God's message to man has always to repent.... No we're not to judge or condemn anyone, but Jesus will not only forgive our sins, but he'll also take the evil desires away also. God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve ! We have a man in our church who came in to our service one night, he repented of his sins(he was a homosexual for years), then God gloriously filled him with the baptism of the Holy Ghost,then we baptised him in water in Jesus' name(Acts 2:38 he gave testimony that night how he was bound in that sin full life style. Over a year has gone by now, Brother Bobby lives for God, you talk about a grateful human being !! He comes to church early, and he's usually the last to leave, he attends all the church services and rallies he can. You can have all kinds of degrees and man's knowlege, and be wise in your own eyes, but people who fail to understand God is Holy, We have a Holy Bible, and heaven is a Holy place.... They're truly missing the whole thing !! We come to God on His terms/ not ours. The drunkard, liar,unbeliever, are also in the same boat without obeying Acts 2:38...2Chonicles 7:14.... we must come clean with God, and Turn from our wicked ways !! John, there is no new message, just any old thing doesn't go with God homosexuallity is an abomination to God, it is not something to be proud of.Let's not forget Sodom and Gommorah Deut.23:17...1Kings 14:24...1Kings 15:12...1Kings 22:46... 2Kings 23:7. God does not make anyone a homosexual, different factors in life can determine this perverted preference... family, relationship with their father or mother, environment, or many other reasons; but God would not condemn something He was unable to deliver someone from !! God will not deliver someone if they refuse to see what they're doing is SIN ! Just because someones father was an alcoholic doesn't mean they have to be, they may even have a genetic "bent" towards drinking exessively, but in my Bible it still says to be a drunkard is punishable eternally, same with "Effeminates" and abusers with theirselves with man kind, But God can easily deliver ANYONE. Salvation is: Deliverence from your present sinfull state. How can we have future salvation, if we don't have it presently ? Jesus changes lives. David
John of AllFaith's reply
Hi,I'm not really sure this is a question, but I'll try and reply.
I am very happy for the man in your church who has come to know God, however I can point to thousands of other people who have come to God and have not been made heterosexual. There are millions of homosexual Christians whose sexual orientations God has not changed.
As you rightly say, there are lots of reasons why people enter the "homosexual lifestyle." Many people are abused by their heterosexual fathers (about 97% of all pedophiles are heterosexual as you probably know) and for a time seek refuge among gay men. This doesn't make them gay. Such people often find freedom in Christ or go on with their lives after a period of recovery, and marry nice women and live happily ever after.
Homosexuality is a sexual orientation, not a lifestyle choice. Not everyone who lives a heterosexual lifestyle is straight and not everyone living a homosexual lifestyle is gay. Sexual orientation is deeper than physical acts.
The "Adam and Steve" analogy is not only old, its irrelevant. Had God made two males only, the human race would have ended. God knows His buisness. What God created was amazing diversity. Homosexuality exists in every species of life that God created on this planet.
What does repentance mean? It means changing one's heart and turning away from sin and to God. Absolutely we are to repent. No question about it. And not just at salvation, but daily... We repent of our sins and turn to God as a matter of our life.
What you need to do now is show that committed same gender marriage and dating is a sin, that God condemns it in the Bible. This is something you can't do. A thing is not sinful simply because you say it is. 'Diligently study the Word to see if these things are true...' Where does the Word condemn it?
There is, as you say, no new message. But at the same, old prejudices do make a thing true either. Growing up in the Old South I was taught at my Baptist church that black skin was the mark of Cain and that people of African decent were therefore "lower" than whites. My pastor taught that the Bible supports slavery (which a couple of verses do!). And yet race prejudice was not Christian view then and its not now, yet many Christians believed it was and could show verses (out of context) to support their prejudices. The same is true here.
Sodom and Gomorra had nothing to do with homosexuality, as Jesus himself said (Matt 10:15). Let me know if you want to read my detailed Bible based study on this topic.
Deut. 23:17, which you cite, is forbidding male Pagan temple Prostitutes (Qadesh ("kaw-dashe") as Strong clearly shows (#6945). There is no question that this is condemned throughout the Scriptures. The word "sodomite" however is not found anywhere in the Hebrew or Greek scriptures. The word "Qadesh" has nothing to do with the city of Sodom nor with homosexuality as an orientation. Its a condemnation of the common Pagan sex rites of the day.
The same is the case with I Kings 14:24, I kings 15:12 etc. According to Jesus himself the sin of Sodom is that the villagers willfully disobeyed the Hebrew hospitality code. This was a major sin, one worthy of death under the Law Moses (Ex. 22:21-24). That this was Sodom's sin is confirmed by Isaiah 1:9-17, Ezekiel:16:49, Matthew 10:11-15, etc.
God does not "make" anyone a heterosexual either. What God and genetics does is place within each of us an inate need and a desire to love and to be loved. Normally this natural urge leads people into a heterosexual orientation. Around 10-15% of the time it leads people into a homosexual orientation. The same is true in the animal kingdom as well. As small percentage of (at least) most animals are homosexual as many recent studies have conclusively proven. Furthermore, some people have very strong sexual urges while others have a slight, of less, sexual drive. It varies with the individual. This is true of both homo and hetero sexuals.
As for the word "effeminate," this is a translation from the Greek word malakee (found only at I Corinthians 6:9). In 1611 the word effeminate meant the same as the word malakee, it was a good translation; an effeminate person was one who was morally and ethically weak. The word had nothing to do with homosexuality when the KJV was translated. I love the KJV, its the main version I use, but we have to be careful to understand words that have changed their meanings over the years.
Those who come to Jesus are wondrously changed by the Holy Spirit, yes indeed. And I know thousands of sincere, devout, God loving, fruit producing Christians who are gay.
As Christians, they form monogamous relationships and give themselves entirely to Christ as married couples, married in God's eyes if not man's. This is why so many of these Christians are working for the same marriage rights (and responsibilities) of other Christians.
I'll be happy to answer any question you might have about homosexuality and the Bible, or other Bible teachings in general. I'd also encourage you to judge not, lest you be judged. Neither you nor I know the heart of another person and God can make anyone stand or fall as He pleases.
In God's love,
-
~Pastor John
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