John of AllFaith's
Biblical Questions
Biblical Answers

Dear Robert

Following a recent missionary outreach to San Francisco, I received a letter via snail mail (US post) which moved me greatly. The letter was from a very devout, God loving, heterosexual Christian evangelist. I will not include his letter here, but in essence it reflected the struggle of a man of God to come to terms with what is admittedly a very complex and at times confusing issue. Having read my account of the healing which God did for me in January of 1999, He asked two basic questions:

1. How do you minister to homosexuals,
2. How do you deal with homosexuals who believe themselves to be in a right relationship with God

The grace and candor of his letter moved me greatly. As many followers of Jesus, Robert has been taught, and tends to believe, that the Bible condemns homosexuality and homosexuals. Following is my response to him (which I sent hard copy on September 27, 1999 since he doesn't "do" computers). Since you, my honored web guest do, do computers and since much of the information I sent him is located here, I will not include all the studies that I included. Rather, I refer you to the other offerings of the Grace Inclusive website.

Hi Robert,

Thanks for your candor and honesty!

I'm going to address your questions in two ways. First, by personal letter and then by including several of my scriptural studies on the specific text in question. The complete versions are all located on line at AllFaith.com but I understand you do not have access to the internet right now.

As I prepared this response it has grown into a rather large document. I apologize if its a bit overwhelming. Your letter strikes me as a sincere desire to get a handle on these issues and I felt led of God to offer a more complete presentation of what I believe the Bible teaches than I otherwise might have.

I sincerely believe that there are millions of people who have not accepted Jesus because this issue is not understood in the light of the scriptures. I wish therefore to give an accurate and detailed reply to your questions.

First, I'd like to say that according to scripture we have no need of anyone to teach us, as the Spirit of God will teach us all things - I John 2:26, 27 ( See note 1 ). Accordingly, I do not presume to teach you here, merely to share a bit of my understanding on this subject.

Scripture also says however that the Spirit gives some of us to be teachers etc. - I Cor.. 12:28 -( See note 2 ). and so we know that sharing our scriptural understandings is a godly endeavor.

As these two scriptures demonstrate, when we take the scriptures from a strictly literal mind-set we appear to find contradictions at times. HOWEVER we know, both by faith and by intellectual examination, that there are NO contradictions in the Holy Word of God. We therefore find, it seems to me, that the problem lies with our method of biblical study.

Jesus warned that the Sabbath was made for people, not we for the Sabbath - Mark 2:27. Likewise, when studying the scriptures it is essential that we understand the writings through the Spirit of Christ and in love. The "letter kills, but the spirit gives life" - II Cor 3:6 ( See note 3 ).. We must therefore seek the spirit of the Word through the Spirit of Christ if we wish to understand the truth of God's love and message for the world and for us as individuals.

Jesus said that the entire Law of Moses as well as all of the prophets could be summed up in a single commandment, which is actually two:

Matt. 22:35: Then one of them, who was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
22:36: Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
22:37: Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
22:38: This is the first and great commandment.
22:39: And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
22:40: On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

So then, at the beginning, whatever the scriptures teach, whether in the Law, the Prophets, the Gospels, the Epistles etc. the central focus will be on the love of God and the love of our fellows. If we infer anything else we are not understanding the passage correctly. Likewise, whatever conclusions you draw from what follows, please know they are presented in love and respect. Personally, if I must err, let me err on the side of God's grace.

Your first question is how do I minister to gays and lesbians:

When ministering to anyone, and here we are speaking of spiritually ministering of course -- sometimes the best thing one can do is to feed someone with physical food - James 2:14-20 ( See note 4 ). -- my first concern is whether or not this person has received Jesus' precious free gift of salvation. If the person has, I say: Praise God! If the person has not, following the lead of the Holy Spirit of course, I share the Good News with them. Nothing else matters. I don't care if the person is heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, transgendered, celibate or anything else for "Whosoever shall call on the name of Savior will be saved" - Romans 10:11-13.

Understand that no one in the history of this planet has ever gone to Heaven for being heterosexual. Likewise, no one has ever gone to Hell for being heterosexual. The same is true for being homosexual, bisexual, transgendered etc. People who go to Heaven go because they have received the free gift of God which is "... through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest anyone should boast" -Eph.. 2:8, 9. Likewise, people who have gone to Hell have done so because "...he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him" - John 3:36.

When presenting the Gospel to the unsaved therefore, the sexual orientation of the person we are sharing with is utterly and completely irrelevant. The only thing that matters is Jesus Christ and him crucified. Everything else merely distracts the person from the real issue - her or his salvation. This is so regardless of what one thinks of the information that follows in this study. Jesus is the Way, not ones sexuality. If homosexuality of itself is a sin -- which I will demonstrate below it is not -- it is only one like any other. Gay people, lesbians, straight people, transgendered people, bisexual people, EVERYONE needs Jesus.

Your second question is how do I minister to gays and lesbians who consider themselves to be on-fire for Jesus already.

First I tell them that they are evil deluded sinners. That they must cease sharing Jesus with others, must leave their ministries, end their marriages, renounce their communities of faith and, most importantly, stop wearing their "What Would Jesus Do" buttons and tee shirts!

Just kidding!

But there are a lot of Christians who say exactly this!

The first thing I do is recall is Romans 14:4:

"Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand."

My fellow Christians must answer for themselves before God concerning their relationship with the Savior. It is not my right, obligation or position to judge another Christian's walk with Jesus. I can only share my understandings and what God and experience has taught me.

In your letter you cite I Corinthians 5:12 and 13 ( See note 5 ). to show that we are to judge in such matters, and you are of course correct. These verses teach this. Its like the case cited above with I John 2:26, 27 and I Cor. 12:28. These commands also appear contradictory, however they are not when scripture is taken as a whole, when we "rightly divide the Word Truth" -- II Tim 2:15.

If we find that a sister or brother is living in unrepentant sin, then following the leading of the Holy Spirit, we would want to minister to them, to encourage them to get right with God, and, perhaps eventually, break off fellowship with them if they do not -- II Thess. 3:15 ( See note 6 ).. If one honestly believes that homosexuality is a sin, that sincere Christian sister or brother may not want to have fellowship with homosexual Christians. I don't question this, only the rightness of their doctrine.

HOWEVER it is vital that before excluding anyone from our congregations and communions that we confirm that they are in fact living in sin and that expelling them is the correct course of action. We must be positive that we are adhering to godly standards rather than succumbing to human prejudices. In the 50's and 60 millions of sincere Christians believed that it was sinful to accept people of African decent as brothers and sisters. Millions accepted slavery as a God ordained institution -- Untold millions of gays and lesbians have been told that God hates them, that they are an "abomination." This harsh certainty on the part of much of the Church, especially evident during the current rise of Neo-Conservatism (i.e. the views of people like Jerry Falwell, Bev Lahey, Fred Phelps etc.), has resulted in a huge segment of these communities renouncing Christianity and their wholesale rejection of Jesus Christ. We are talking about millions of souls for whom Jesus died being pushed away from Jesus by Christians.

Before looking at the scriptural teachings in this matter, let's first think about the results of this current campaign against gays and lesbians.

At Matthew 25:31-46 ( See note 7 ). our Savior identifies with the social outcasts. As a society we have no greater outcast class than homosexuals. Speaking as an outcaste, Jesus embraced those who came and showed him love. He blesses them and invites them into eternal life. With regard those who failed to show love and compassion, he says: "Depart from me! I never knew you!" This was so, even though they cried "Lord Lord! Did we not..." - Matthew 7:21.

How do gays and lesbians, at large, view the Church of Jesus today? Do they see a movement of people who are loving them, nurturing them, trying to help them? No! They see a hypocritical group of people who seemingly have nothing better to do than condemn them and deny their civil rights. They do this in Jesus' name, and yet I can almost hear the Savior say "Depart from me..."

There are of course many many Christians who welcome gays and lesbians into full communion, denominations such as the United Church of Christ, the Episcopal Church, much of the United Methodist Church, the Dignity, Integrity, AWAB, TEN, groups etc. within the mainline denominations, however the perception remains.

Scripture very clearly teaches that divorce is a sin. There can be, and is, no question about this theologically - Lev. 21:13-15,( See note 8 ). Mark 10:2-12 ( See note 9 ).. And yet despite the fact that the Church's divorce rate is as high as the rest of societies, practically no church leaders speak out against it anymore (it was a common thing to condemn when I was kid in church). And yet even though there are only 8 verses in the entire Bible which can conceivably be interpreted as restricting homosexuality, many Christians feel the need to condemn gays and lesbians and make their salvation contingent upon changing their sexual orientation.

Were I to say to you, Robert, Jesus loves you! He died on the cross for your sins, he rose from the dead to save you and right now you can receive Jesus! All you have to do is ask him to come into your heart and begin having sex with men! Would you receive Jesus? Not likely! And yet this is what so many Christians tell gays and lesbians, who find heterosexual relations just as unnatural for them and as undesirable as many of those demanding their sexual conversion find homosexuality.

By teaching this condition-based plan of salvation these people are adding to the scripture and casting a major stumbling block in the way of those who would come to know Jesus - Roman 14:13 ( See note 10 ).. Then, once a gay person deals with the issue, accepts Jesus as personal Savior, dedicates his or her life to God, they are still rejected by other Believers and must either remain in the closet within the heterosexual churches or segregate themselves into one of the gay church groups like the Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches.

Now consider this entire section of scripture for a moment:

Rom. 14:

10 ... But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. 14:12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.
14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.
14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died...

Note that it is not the brother or sister who is "weak" but the one who is strong that is commanded to show respect and love. If I know that eating foods which have been sacrificed to Pagan idols is not really a problem since there is really only one God -- this was the immediate context -- still I must respect those who do not understand this more enlightened teaching, brothers and sisters who are slaves to legalism and spiritual insecurity. I am commanded not to make an issue of this freedom by my eating this meat around the weaker person.

In the same way, if I "know" that homosexuality is sinful, that this is an issue my sister or brother has yet to grasp, I must be very careful to avoid causing divisions over the issue, believing that in time Jesus -- my brother's Master -- will enlighten my brother or sister to the truth I know. This is not the attitude displayed by much of the Church however! We "grief" our brothers and destroy their faith by placing requirements on them which they are not ready or able to make; they for whom Christ died. We say to those we believe are weaker in the faith, "You are not OK. Your sin is such that Jesus considers you to be an abomination no matter how sincere you are, no matter much you pray or study the Bible, no matter what! Repent or hit the highway! You are not welcome here!" In other words, "such Christians are attempting to shove this 'meat' down their throats! I know you are not saying this Robert, but many do.

The text continues:

14:16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of:
14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.
14:18 For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men.
14:19 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another.
14:20 For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offense.
14:21 It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

The addition of the phrase "or anything..." shows that this principle is much greater than merely foods sacrificed to idols -- which, by the way, was an issue because such foods were cheaper and more affordable than regular food -- yet some people, citing scripture which condemns the eating of such foods, were concerned. It was the heart attitude Paul said that mattered. These people were not eating the foods BECAUSE they had been sacrificed to idols, but because of financial constraints. Again, all the Law and the Prophets are subject to love of God and neighbor.

14:22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth.
14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Those who are not homosexuals should not take part in homosexual relationships. For them, they are unnatural and would tend to produce a guilty conscience, hence they would be "damned" due to going against what they know to be the Spirit's will for them and their natural sexual orientation. Gay people, by the way, are not trying to "recruit" heterosexuals. Such is not possible. That's not what this ministry or any other is about.

For those homosexuals who love God with "all their hearts, souls, minds and strengths and who seek to love their neighbors as themselves," and who have come to realize that neither the Bible nor Jesus condemns them, it is a different matter. Their consciences do not condemn them because they are doing nothing wrong or unnatural. They are being the people God made them to be. HOWEVER, those gay and lesbian Christians who are unsure, not about their God given sexual orientation but about what the Bible teaches on this important issue, will find it difficult to stand in the assurance of faith, being condemned by their fellow Believers at every turn. For them, it is the very Body of Christ which causes their doubts and limits their walk with Jesus! How tragic! More on this below.

At this point, in my reply to Robert, I presented my study on Romans One.

Notes

I John 2:26, 27:

These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you.
But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
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I Cor. 12:28:

And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues
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II Cor 3:6:

Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
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James 2:14-20:

Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
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I Corinthians 5:12, 13:

For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
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II Thess. 3:15:

Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.
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Matthew 25:31-46:

When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35 For I was an hungered, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungered, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungered, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
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Lev. 21:13-15:

13 And he shall take a wife in her virginity.
14 A widow, or a divorced woman, or profane, or an harlot, these shall he not take: but he shall take a virgin of his own people to wife.
15 Neither shall he profane his seed among his people: for I the LORD do sanctify him.
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Mark 10:2-12:

2 And the Pharisees came to him, and asked him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife? tempting him.
3 And he answered and said unto them, What did Moses command you?
4 And they said, Moses suffered to write a bill of divorcement, and to put her away.
5 And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
7 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
8 And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
9 What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
10 And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
11 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
12 And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.
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Roman 14:13:

Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way.
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